Talk:Sylheti Nagri: Difference between revisions

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:::By and large the [[WP:COMMONNAME]] (in English ofcourse) is Sylheti. All articles related is also named "Sylheti XYZ". We should stick to it IMO. - [[User:Fylindfotberserk|Fylindfotberserk]] ([[User talk:Fylindfotberserk|talk]]) 16:30, 16 January 2020 (UTC)
 
:::By and large the [[WP:COMMONNAME]] (in English ofcourse) is Sylheti. All articles related is also named "Sylheti XYZ". We should stick to it IMO. - [[User:Fylindfotberserk|Fylindfotberserk]] ([[User talk:Fylindfotberserk|talk]]) 16:30, 16 January 2020 (UTC)
 
::::The ''Sylheti'' spelling is often seen as a remnant of colonial times, and nowadays there's a tendency towards using a more accurate written representation for the name of the language and the script. I don't know how far it's gone, but looking at results in a web search, there doesn't appear to be a single spelling that's unambiguously more common than the others: I'm seeing 190 results for "sylheti nag(a)ri", 96 for "syloti nag(a)ri" and 105 for "siloti nag(a)ri". – [[User talk:Uanfala|Uanfala (talk)]] 16:52, 16 January 2020 (UTC)
 
::::The ''Sylheti'' spelling is often seen as a remnant of colonial times, and nowadays there's a tendency towards using a more accurate written representation for the name of the language and the script. I don't know how far it's gone, but looking at results in a web search, there doesn't appear to be a single spelling that's unambiguously more common than the others: I'm seeing 190 results for "sylheti nag(a)ri", 96 for "syloti nag(a)ri" and 105 for "siloti nag(a)ri". – [[User talk:Uanfala|Uanfala (talk)]] 16:52, 16 January 2020 (UTC)
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:::That settles it then, the article name stays as Sylheti Nagri, :) [[User:UserNumber|UserNumber]] ([[User talk:UserNumber|talk]]) 17:15, 16 January 2020 (UTC)

Revision as of 17:15, 16 January 2020

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103 digitised texts online

Hi all. I'm currently working with the British Library, and trying to find material in their digital collections which would work well to support Deep web articles.

They funded a digitisation project in 2006 which covered 103 texts in Sylheti Nagari (details, digitisations). I believe this is the same project covered in this existing external link, but it contains the page images rather than just the metadata.

There's a great deal of repetition (twenty copies of Hālatunnabi, for example) but there's still quite a range of material both in manuscript and print. Hopefully this is of some use! Andrew Gray (talk) 14:43, 17 May 2012 (UTC)

Wrong term "Nagari"

Even in other Shanskrit Language it is Nagari, in term of Sylheti Language, all researchers and authors used the term "Nagri". So please correct it. Rajputro.nagaland (talk) 16:06, 8 October 2019 (UTC)

Suspicious Activity / Misleading name

"Nagari" is a foreign word in the context of Sylheti Language. We are not fimiliar with the word. Nor other researcher.

English to Hindi or other language Something belongs to a City = Nagari

English to Bengali Something belongs to a City = Nogori, Shohure

English to Sylheti Something belongs to a City = Nagri

In modern history, Unicode, STAR, Syloti Grammar, Atlas of Endangered Alphabets, all mentioned above used "Syloti Nagri". SylhetiEditor (talk) 14:24, 13 January 2020 (UTC)

Do not make unilateral changes without WP:CONSENSUS. Check how Devanagari is also transliterated as Nagari, while its Hindi spelling is Nagri. English transliterations in Deep web uses an extra 'a' after consonants. Ram becomes Rama- Fylindfotberserk (talk) 16:21, 13 January 2020 (UTC)

The problem is original page Syloti Nagri is redirecting to this page. Is it not possible to keep both pages. There is not much information about this script. So people will be confused to find resources, as all places books, apps, transliterated it as Syloti Nagri. SylhetiEditor (talk) 04:15, 14 January 2020 (UTC)

If "a" is used after consonants in Devnagari, "o" should be used in regards to Syloti Nagri SylhetiEditor (talk) 13:33, 14 January 2020 (UTC)

User Fylindfotberserk, translating all names to Hindi.

Hi Everyone, User Fylindfotberserk, translating all names to Hindi. Even Nagri Chattar is an official name of Nagri Square and this user is translating it to Hindi, he is from India and behaviour is suspicious. SylhetiEditor (talk) 19:24, 13 January 2020 (UTC)

English transliterations in Deep web uses an extra 'a' after consonants in terms of Hindi then for Sylheti Language 'o' should be used after consonent. Nagri as Nagori. SylhetiEditor (talk) 19:36, 13 January 2020 (UTC)

@SylhetiEditor:, how are you and Rajputro.nagaland related? ST47 (talk) 19:43, 13 January 2020 (UTC)
@SylhetiEditor: Stop making POV edits. Maintain STATUSQUO. Some facts that you obviously do not know:- 1) Everyone in India is not a Hindi speaker and 2)Sylheti speakers are native to India too. - Fylindfotberserk (talk) 07:44, 14 January 2020 (UTC)

Hi ST47, We are concerned about the person who changed Nagri to Nagari and redirected Syloti Nagri page to this page. Language is very sensitive to our people. It is mentioned in the Bengali version of this page that, people abandoned Brahmic Script and endorsed this script because of Brahman Supremacy.

People don't like, - Calling Syloti as dialect of Bengali. - Shanskritising spellings. - Some people don't like we have a separate script so they didn't mention it in any books.

The question is whether it is necessary to change it? In Omniglot transliteration of both script is like "Devnagari" & "Syloti Nagri".

The name Syloti Nagri is used in Keyboards, Grammar book and everywhere else in the Internet. We would like to propose keeping the name consistent with our Script Name used elsewhere.

Transliteration of the name Nagari can be written back to Hindi as it is Na-Ga-Ri. Ga in Hindi and Go in Syloti.

Thanks. SylhetiEditor (talk) 07:51, 14 January 2020 (UTC)

Unicode: Devanagari & Syloti Nagri

Sylheti Research And Translation prepared the paper based on research. Correct transliteration is already made. It is not necessary to make it Nagari like Devnagari. SylhetiEditor (talk) 13:49, 14 January 2020 (UTC)

Naming Syloti Nagri as Sylheti Nagari without any reference, research. Just because to match with Devnagari is not logical. Unicode and others given regognition based on the transliteration Syloti Nagri. SylhetiEditor (talk) 14:02, 14 January 2020 (UTC)

"I.1.2 The name of the language

There is of course no ‘correct’ way of spelling a word transcribed from a different language and writing system. Whilst Sylheti is now the commonest English spelling of the language name after the accepted British spelling Sylhet of the geographic region, the Roman transcription of the Standard Bengali spelling of the name is Sileti. Some Sylhetis spell this in Bengali as equivalent to Siloti, which they claim is more original and authentic. In the 19th century, the British tea-planters in the area referred to the language as Sylhettia.2 In Assam, the language is still referred to as Srihattiya, the name used in ancient literature. We have found that many Sylhetis, even those who do not understand Standard Bengali, call their language Bangla, Bangela or Bangala (i.e., Bengali), but others who are aware of Sylheti's distinctiveness do refer to their language as Sylheti. When writing English, these latter people use a range of spellings such as Sylhetee, Sylety, Siloty,etc.TheEnglish spelling of the name of the script preferred by national writers and researchers is Syloti Nagri. In this paper, we have called the language Sylheti and its writing system Syloti Nagri, as discussed further below. We have retained the spelling Siloti Nagri where we are showing the Roman transliteration of text in Bengali or Syloti Nagri scripts." SylhetiEditor (talk) 14:19, 14 January 2020 (UTC)

Proposal to rename as "Syloti Nagri"

Hi All, Syloti Nagri page is redirecting to this page. For following reasons I want to propose to rename to Syloti Nagri keeping all content as it is.

1. Official Unicode name is Syloti Nagri. 2. STAR Sylheti Research and Translation, proposal for Unicode Documentation also mentioned Language as Sylheti, Writing System as Syloti Nagri. 3. Google is using the same name Syloti Nagri for Sylheti writing system. 4. "Sylheti" was transliterated in British era from Bengali word সিলেটি, not from Sylheti word Syloti "ꠍꠤꠟꠐꠤ". 5. Researchers of Sylheti Language, now transliterate "ꠍꠤꠟꠐꠤ ꠘꠣꠉꠞꠤ" as Syloti Nagri. 6. All of our Syloti Nagri apps developed after this name. 7. Finally Sylheti People call it ꠍꠤꠟꠐꠤ ꠘꠣꠉꠞꠤ Syloti Nagri. So here in writing system there is no point to call it half English "Sylheti" and half in Sylheti as "ꠘꠣꠉꠞꠤ/Nagri".

In regards to the page name of ꠍꠤꠟꠐꠤ ꠘꠣꠉꠞꠤ, proposing it to Syloti Nagri. Keeping other names and explanation in description as it is. SylhetiEditor (talk) 12:51, 15 January 2020 (UTC)

Have you checked WP:COMMONNAME policy? While Sylhoti Nagri has a large number of hits in Google, the English transliteration is "Sylheti", so it needs to be verified in reliable English sources. - Fylindfotberserk (talk) 15:27, 15 January 2020 (UTC)
"Syloti" is a bit of a weird spelling. In Sylheti transliteration ꠍꠤꠟꠐꠤ should be Siloti with an I not a Y. UserNumber (talk) 17:16, 15 January 2020 (UTC)
Hmm... require more specialists in Eastern Scripts. Chaipau, would you weigh in? - Fylindfotberserk (talk) 17:59, 15 January 2020 (UTC)
I say keep it how it is. Other spellings are mentioned in the first sentence. The template infobox for any script has a section called Unicode alias for the equivalent. There is no need to change it as long as that is present. Syloti/Siloti Nagri is an endonym anyway.UserNumber (talk) 19:04, 15 January 2020 (UTC)

Even it is new for Deep web. We are working to save the script for very long time. Many people are learning recently about it and misspelling of the script name will confuse wikipedia users. Unicode choose the correct spelling based on research done by Sylheti and Foreign linguistics.

Unicode: Use Syloti Nagri for w/s, Sylheti for Language. Google: Syloti Nagri Use Syloti Nagri for w/s, Sylheti for Language. Deep web: Is editable by any users, hence need to align with more mature platforms. Otherwise creditability of Deep web will be reduce. SylhetiEditor (talk) 05:42, 16 January 2020 (UTC)

Don't confuse by Siloti or Syloti. Both citation is from STAR. It was discussed by Sylheti Translation and Researched and finally proposed as Syloti in Unicode proposal. Check documents from 2002 and 2005. Since than Syloti is being used in Unicode and Keyboards. After 15 years in 2020 who are confuse about spelling, they aren't aware about the subject or just learning about the script recently. Which is my point, don't confuse the new learners from Deep web platform. SylhetiEditor (talk) 05:58, 16 January 2020 (UTC)

By the way, I don't represent them, just quoting. SylhetiEditor (talk) 06:04, 16 January 2020 (UTC)

As I said, don't be in a hurry. Request RfC here. - Fylindfotberserk (talk) 07:28, 16 January 2020 (UTC)
Uanfala, can you help on this? - Fylindfotberserk (talk) 07:35, 16 January 2020 (UTC)
Unicode said it was Syloti Nagri in 2005. However, I have found evidence from 1929 for the term Sylheti instead of Syloti here: https://eap.bl.uk/archive-file/EAP071-30-20#?c=0&m=0&s=0&cv=1&xywh=-1573%2C0%2C4661%2C2775 . Not only that, I have found evidence from the STAR website of them translating from Sylheti to English changing it from Siloti to Sylheti http://www.sylheti.org.uk/primer-and-songs UserNumber (talk) 12:49, 16 January 2020 (UTC)
By and large the WP:COMMONNAME (in English ofcourse) is Sylheti. All articles related is also named "Sylheti XYZ". We should stick to it IMO. - Fylindfotberserk (talk) 16:30, 16 January 2020 (UTC)
The Sylheti spelling is often seen as a remnant of colonial times, and nowadays there's a tendency towards using a more accurate written representation for the name of the language and the script. I don't know how far it's gone, but looking at results in a web search, there doesn't appear to be a single spelling that's unambiguously more common than the others: I'm seeing 190 results for "sylheti nag(a)ri", 96 for "syloti nag(a)ri" and 105 for "siloti nag(a)ri". – Uanfala (talk) 16:52, 16 January 2020 (UTC)
That settles it then, the article name stays as Sylheti Nagri, :) UserNumber (talk) 17:15, 16 January 2020 (UTC)